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Countryside Jobs Service |
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CJS Discussion Board - Person Specs |
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You are here> Info > Main Board> Person Specs |
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Why don’t ‘person specs.’ Work?
For the umpteenth time in the space of a few months, I have VERY carefully completed an application form based upon the requirements of the post given in information contained in a) the job description, b)the person specification (including the essential & desirable criteria), and c) the duties of the post. Naturally, this all takes time, which I don't mind, providing that the end justifies the means. My beef is this - WHY, oh why, oh why do prospective employers shift the goalposts re; job requirements or person specification AFTER sending out the application packs? Having applied for two jobs recently for which I would have at least expected an interview, it pains me to hear that I didn't have this experience, or that qualification, or no mention of it on my application form, and hence, no interview. No mention of the need for this experience or that qualification in the application pack et al. When I pointed out that I had demonstrated on my application ALL (and beyond, occasionally) the desired and essential criteria outlined by them in the first place, I was therefore at a loss to understand why I had not even been considered for interview. Much embarrassed shuffling of feet from the other end of the 'phone. Then the platitudes: "Oh, well, you WERE the next in line for interview". "We were very impressed with your application". "You're on the 'reserve' list, should anyone drop out" (as if there is the remotest possibility, given the current climate!) "We loved your website", and so on, ad nauseum. I became redundant shortly before Christmas through no fault of my own - I was only internally promoted the year before, and some bright spark said "Oh, we also wondered WHY you were still out of work after nearly 12 months. Thanks, muppet, I really needed to hear that. It's those very attitudes that keep some very worthwhile people out of work - they end up putting lids on pies for three times the money - and who can blame them? I'm keen. I'm competent (which is more than can be said for some of my contemporaries). I want to work in the profession I love. So why do recruitment managers shift the goalposts without doing anything useful, like actually informing anyone, for example? Answers on a postcard please..., [or on the Board, CJS] yours, Well & truly hacked off, Cheshire Details supplied. (Ref: PSD) Replies:►1. On 2/10/02: The problem is that employers usually receive so many applications that do meet the minimum person spec, that to interview a reasonable number (6 - 8) they have to impose tighter selection criteria, or read between the lines of your application form. They are obviously going to interview those people that they feel are best for the job, and unless you put lots more relevant information in the 'Other Information' box, you will be selected out. I recently had an application from someone who had volunteered with us, who could do the job well, but put down nothing except his hobby in the other info section. Under equal opportunities, I could not justify asking him for an interview, since all I (and the other selection panel members) knew about him was what he put on the application form. Take your time and write in ALL relevant information. Details supplied (Ref: PSD-R1)
►2. On 3/10/02: I was discussing this topic with a friend some months ago and I am not surprised that you have had uncomfortable explanations from prospective employers. The selection process for short-listing for interviews is very much a case of chance. This means that it is impossible to interview everyone who is qualified for the post. Therefore, the selection criteria comes down to pedantry and an application can be scrubbed simply because it contains one spelling mistake, and incorrect term of address or any number of small mistakes. I find this a particularly frustrating problem and it gets worse because this can be applied to interviews. I have fairly firm evidence that I was called to a very expensive interview with a certain organisation when the result had been predetermined. Worse still, the post I currently hold had changed spec' between me filling out the app' form and attending the interview. I gambled on taking the job when it was offered and happily that has paid off. Mind you, I am still applying for internal stuff and I can tell you that I am encountering the same difficulties, so the situation does not necessarily improve once one gets into the industry. Details supplied (Ref: PSD-R2)
►3. On 28/5/03. I can understand your frustration with not being interviewed when you meet the person spec, It's happened to me several times. I'm now employed and have short-listed and interviewed twice for an assistant on a one-year contract. The first time the salary was £12k and we had 50 applicants, the second time the salary was £15k and we had 80 applicants. Nearly all applicants had relevant degrees and very many had relevant experience. Reducing the list to six was very hard, but my organisation was very careful to do this in a fair and objective manner. However inevitably with such a high standard of applicants some people who were probably capable of doing the job well didn't get an interview. My only advice is to relate your own experience to the PSpec and keep trying. One time you might be lucky, I was...after six years volunteering and three years part-time/contract work. Details supplied (ref: PSD-R3)
►4. on 26/11/03 - CJ of London says: I wholeheartedly agree with the ridiculously unhelpful applications process. I have a Bsc in environmental chemistry and an Msc in marine management, associated ancillary qualifications coming out my ears, volunteer experience, environmental consultancy and technical experience, team management experience and an overwhelming (fast becoming underwhelming) desire to get a decent job. I can say that after 140 job applications since leaving uni I am having a hard time reconciling anything as a positive note. I have tried every single approach I can think of and some I can't and have had other people dream up for me. When, oh when will recruiters realise a huge potential employee pool is going begging because we despise the present recruitment system? - we despise its lack of humanity, its lack of feedback, we despise years of CV training only to be told not to add it to our application forms, we're tired of ridiculous specs, ridiculous education / experience parameters, ridiculous and useless explanatory notes, unhelpful feedback (if you even get any) and a whole demeaning and dehumanising round of mailshots, photocopying, emailing and telephoning only to get some gumby at the end of a phone line say, "Sorry, I cant help you". Its no wonder this country is losing university graduates like they were fleeing a sinking ship - the ship is sinking. We are human - every application form you get is a human at the end of the post service - a human who may have sweated blood and tears to get that damn badly worded, terribly laid out piece of rubbish you call an application form in on time. This is a human who's entire career may hinge on what you do and how you treat them - we're not asking for miracles - we just want to be treated like adults - with respect or we're all gonna go off to somewhere warmer, somewhere drier. (ref: PSD-R4)
►5. On 17/12/03 Hi - I have been following the various pieces on this topic of trying to gain employment and all your waxings bring back memories. To be honest though, although I can share the sheer sense of frustration (it took me five years to get my first full time post)I don't think it is fair to put all the onus on the employer for this sad and sorry situation. The fact of the matter is although the system we have is not perfect, it is hard to think of a better one for candidate selection; whatever employers do, there will always be some winners and a lot more losers. Lets face it, if you are an employer with thirty application forms from people who, on paper at least, can all clearly do the job but you only require say eight for interview what do you do? Obviously you are going to start to look even harder at the slightest thing that may help you whittle it down, from our point of view, i.e. those applying for said job, we equally as understandably feel aggrieved that we may have been turned away for what may seem to us very spurious reasons. Just two I have been quoted are, 'your interview was excellent but the only thing was that possibly you spoke too much', and more recently a point of presentation; 'I had tipexed out an error on the application form' (my error)!! In the latter I drove one hour to pick up the ruddy form and another hour to deliver it back by hand; a round driving time of four hours; I was keen and had to fill the form out in a hurry, thanks to postal strikes delaying the arrival of the original application form I had requested by post! In both cases it was obviously a close run thing and the employer had to give me some sort of answer. The brutal fact of the matter is that as a nation we are churning out many more qualified individuals than for whom there will ever be jobs; also, the environment is still lower down the national ladder of priorities compared to say banking, or anything else that may have an implication of financial gain. Why? Human society is still materialistic, greedy short sighted and selfish and until as a species we put far more into conservation there will always be more who want to do it than there will be vacancies because those in positions of power, who create the employment markets, will always have their fingers in the money pie and give priority to that which they consider financially important, as opposed to environmentally so. Result? Silly wages and sometimes equally silly reasons given for not getting an interview due to an extremely high level of competition for vacancies when they do arise. Personally, I am seriously considering going in to freelance ecological surveying/ consultancy work; that seems to be very hard work initially but those that persevere seem to do well in the end and they don't have to spend an inordinate amount of time filling in application forms. Well that is me done for now. Sympathy and best wishes to all but above all DON'T GIVE UP. S. P. of East Sussex (Ref: PSD-R5)
►On 5/10/04: While I sympathise with the comments on this thread, I also have to ask why a lot of applicants don't read the specs properly ? I regularly advertise for volunteers and staff and try to be as specific as possible to avoid wasting everyone's time, but I despair when a spec which clearly states "must have driving licence" gets replies that start " although I do not have a driving licence..." I'm sorry but those go straight in the bin, perhaps I should specify "must have the common sense god gave a weeble" Details Supplied. (Ref: PSD-R6) I want to add a piece / comment -
The views contained on this page are not necessary those held by CJS. |
